Tuesday, August 23, 2011

That's Right, It's All About THEIR Pain

Dear Readers, I have shortened my last post down to these phrases, that I think sum up the whole thing rather nicely. This time, I've only taken comments from the estranged parents (and one from Dr. Coleman). In a nutshell, it's very telling.

I would believe that most of us who post on this board were good parents

I was not abusive

This site isn't for you or your parents

Your parents are who they are

I thought his rebellion and sullen character was due to...his conflicted feelings about his father

No one is perfect

maybe [the estranged parent is] not wholly at fault

I am not perfect

Parents can't be blamed for the total estrangement.

Many of us, including myself, in this forum did a great job of parenting.

it will be hard for him to live with the guilt of what he has chosen.

I don't think I will ever know what I did to them to have them both "abandon" me

As parents, most of us try to do the best we know how

I think they lose respect.

I...feel that there is lack of respect today

Self-inflicted blame, worry and devaluation is completely damaging and affects all aspects of my life

So settle in...give yourself a pat on the back

I didn't abuse her in any way, shape, form or fashion

I hate this young women [my estranged daughter] has become

I just want to work on whatever went wrong. But she refuses.

it is horrible to reject a parent, any parent in the world

she is going to be very sorry some day for treating you like this.

No matter what you do it doesn't seem to work.

I may have been wrong, who knows.

I made my mistakes and wasn't perfect

If I'm guilty of anything it is being too good to them

children today do not care about anyone but themselves.

All they care about is what they will inherit

We can't change the past.

We did what we did with what we knew at that time.

Nobody's perfect

I don't deserve this!!

these girls of mine have been mean spirited, disrespectful, nasty and hateful towards me

THEY are responsible for this estrangement, not ME.

it's about time they grow up and act like adults and take responsibility for their issues

I wonder if they know we are right but are too proud to admit it

they need to "look in the mirror" and grow up and take responsibility.

they've decided that being a bully is better than being bullied.

I'm sick of feeling hurt, victimized, tormented, and tortured.

Do I want them back? (not sure anymore)

"let's beat mommy to the ground (emotionally)"

He is doing what He thinks is best for all concerned. 

"judge not, lest ye be judged." 

you do owe them common courtesy

How can you forgive those who have hurt you if you can't even forgive yourself.

take your dialogue back to your own blog or forum.

the purpose of other estranged adult children who are posting here is to reduce the pain of the parents on this forum

this was the forum for people to help each other heal

sometimes you have to apologize for something you did not do


  1. i give my second post there, oh 10..20 minutes.

  2. words cannot express how much i hate coleman right now. did you catch that quote of him?

    Yes, Viv, I was on the phone on the July 21st seminar. Dr. Coleman touched upon many of my own feelings. He said, "…Nothing is more infuriating, humiliating and devastating that the rejection from an adult child."

    that right there cinched it. ohhhhh pleeeeaaaassse. yeaaaaaahhh riiiiiiight. omg, give me a break. what an enabling pandering freak.

  3. Lisa - I didn't see your second post, but he definitely deleted it. Too much of a "dissenting opinion", I guess. I can see why people might not like the use of swears, but other than that, there was nothing "offensive" about what you said. I have to agree with you about Dr. Coleman though...I'm not sure his motives are pure. I think he just knows "where his bread is buttered" (to put it in the words of an anonymous commenter). Is he enabling them? Yes, absolutely. I think it's really sad.

  4. Correction: In my opinion, there was nothing offensive about what you said. (I can't really state that as fact, because I recognize that people may very well have been offended. But I wasn't.)

  5. i'll one up you and flat out say he's a full blown narcissist. of this, i am sure.
    i would post a third time, to say "go fuck yourself" if i wanted to waste any more time on this douche. but i won't. he's a doucchee! satisfyingly, as with most narcs, the best and only way to deal with them is to flat out call them a jackass and move on.
    oh yeah, i didn't expect anyone to read my comment, except for the moderator/aka coleman, i mostly did it for my enjoyment. and coleman got to read it. he told me to not criticize others on the forum. i didn't criticize others, i criticized YOU.

    but ahah, of course i handily copy pasted cause i knew this fucker would delete it, so here it is for your viewing pleasure! thanks guys!

    a few points:
    "gee, i wonder how me EC is able to deal with the pain of the loss of my presence in their lives."
    answer: that is like asking someone why they don't want a giant rotating ball of razor blades in their lives. i think they probably don't want you there because you were hurtful. the end.

    two, your children are not responsible for you or your lives or your emotional well-being. they don't owe you jackshit. they're supposed to grow up, be adults, and have their own independent lives. if you guys have problems, it's probably because your own parents were fucked up and now you're just transferring your repressed childhood neediness and rage onto your own kids who don't owe you jackshit and are not responsible for being there for you.
    isn't this psychology 101? apparently dr. coleman didn't go to class.


    RJ said:
    Yes, Viv, I was on the phone on the July 21st seminar. Dr. Coleman touched upon many of my own feelings. He said, "…Nothing is more infuriating, humiliating and devastating that the rejection from an adult child."

    wow. wow. nothing is more infuriating, humiliating, and devastating than the rejection of an adult child?
    wow. there are so many things wrong with this sentence i can't even begin.
    you call this therapy dr. coleman? seriously?
    wth is wrong with you?
    and how do you know that? are you an 'EP' too? and is that your view on it?
    don't you think if a full grownass parent feels INFURIATED + HUMILIATED + DEVASTATED by their adult child's "rejection", there is something wrong with them and their thinking. infuriated and humiliated and devastated? jesus, not a good combination.
    1. why does one feel infuriated? has the child committed some sort of blasphemy? are you some sort of god who deserves to be admired and given attention to at all times and any little smite or rejection is infuriating? EGO.
    2. humiliated? what? why would you feel humiliated by your own kid? what is this, the schoolyard and someone pulled down your pants? REPRESSED FEELINGS!
    3. and this one is the cincher. devastated. why on earth would you be devastated? you're a full grown adult, your kid's a full grown adult. do you need them to live? no. are you dependent on your child for being taken care of? no (OR YOU SHOULDN'T BE). so why on earth would you be devastated? that's really not an appropriate response.
    i understand annoyance, hurt, clashes, even anger, but i do not see why an adult should feel INFURIATED, HUMILIATED, and DEVASTATED just because their grownass kid, who is a full grown independent person, has got a life of their own.

    seriously, dr. coleman?

  6. Ah! How refreshing Lisa. So spot on, so true. (No wonder why he deleted it! You're making him look bad in front of his favorite clientele!) Your points are strong and well-said.

    "They probably didn't want you in their lives because you were hurtful. The end." Brilliant! That's really what it all comes down to.

  7. The rolling ball of razor blade comment is so to the point, and makes a great visual. It's also what a lot of people feel who need to make a painful decision (or live with a painful decision)made for their own good and well being.

  8. Winterskiprincess just posted another reply on Dr. Coleman's forum. She made the statement about this man being the doctor that encouraged an estranged mother to go on national TV (I believe it was Oprah or some such chat show)regarding how wounded she was because her adult daughter cut her off. This was some months back and I believe it was Upsi who had reached out to the daughter and we got her side of the story, i.e., the TRUTH.

    Anyway, I did not know Dr. Coleman was that doctor. So I publically withdraw my previous comments regarding this debate. It appears I was wrong about him and the parents on that forum. I stand corrected.

  9. Cindi - Thank you. I appreciate you taking the time to come back and share your thoughts with us again. Dr. Coleman is, indeed, the doctor who you have mentioned and Upsi did reach out to the daughter of the estranged mother from that talk show.

    I can sense your sincerity and I think it is a hard thing to do to admit your feelings about being wrong. So again, thank you.

  10. Cindi,

    I didn't see your initial comment, but I doubt I would have held it against you LOL. You seem to be a kind and thoughtful person, which is refreshing.

    So thank you for your kind and thoughtful comments:) I don't think that many healthy adults hold differing opinions against another. It is the outright hostility or dishonesty that gets me.

  11. I think we should overwhelm the forum with our perspective.

  12. Anon - I think this is a brilliant idea!

  13. Just wanted to say THANK YOU for your blog. I am not an ACoN, but my husband was. It's been difficult to find anything on the net about Ns and their ability to hurt and damage the spouses of their children.
    And please tell your husband thank you -- I also read his blog. Like your husband, mine put me and our children first. We had a wonderful, fairytale marriage that lasted almost 14 years. We have 2 wonderful daughters. My husband saw the pain his FOO caused, but we did not know there was a name for it; we did not know what an N was.
    Sadly, this wonderful man passed away of cancer when he was 49. During his last 2 weeks he became more acutely aware of the Ns in his FOO (and the enablers and Flying Monkeys), but again, not aware that they could not be reasoned with.
    I and my children cut off his FOO within months of my husband's death. And I KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt that he would approve. I also know that had he lived and became aware of NPD he would have cut them off himself. Sadly, he died after telling me "I tried, Hon. I don't know why they treat you the way they do, but don't think I don't see it. I am so sorry."
    I miss him.
    - Sad Widow

  14. Sad Widow - I'm terribly sorry to hear about your husband's passing. Your story is both incredibly powerful and poignantly sad. I do think it's wonderful that you and your husband found each other, it sounds like you brightened each others' lives during the time you were together.

    I know first-hand, how difficult it is to be married to an ACoN...the difficulties they face in their lives as a direct result of the type of parents they had is evident and heart-breaking. There have been many times that I've been deeply upset for my husband because he never really felt loved by some of the most important people in his life. Now, it is so, so important that he knows that his FOC (family of choice) is his number one priority...the ties he has made by choice are so much stronger than the ties he had no choice in.

    It seems there are not many blogs out there, or resources written for spouses of ACoNs, and I'm really glad that mine (and my husband's) are able to help you in some small way.

    And again, I'm terribly, terribly sorry for the loss of your dear husband. From the sounds of it, he was much like my own husband...a wonderful person with a beautiful soul, who became great DESPITE his parents, not because of them.